Reflections on TZM

Namaste RyanAnne, thank you so much for your input!

I agree that the Movement isn't as active as I'd like to see it. The Movement seems to like to boast about how many people we have signed up on the main webpage, but I think that many fail to realize the very things that you have talked about. Many people are "a member of the Movement", but few are active.

Only until recently did I begin to get involved in my local Chapter. I found it to be very inactive - no response from State coordinator, broken website,etc. So recently I, along with a few other local members, have started to attempt to build something. I would suggest that you get into contact with your State Coordinator, and if there isn't one (I know that there's a long list of openings on the Forum), talk to Jen (US Coordinator) about becoming one. Email me at kitaki2crows@gmail.com and I can give you her address.

Another helpful thing is to get signed up with the Google Groups mailing list. I just recently began to listen in on meetings on Teamspeak 3. I don't have a mic to be fully involved, but I can type my input into the chat room. Here's past US Chapter Meetings: http://zeitgeistuniversity.com/USMeetings.html

I think that the Movement is polarizing a little as of recently. Some (too many) blindly follow Peter and Fresco, and are largely inactive. These same people do not research the information on their own, but are spoon fed and in turn spit it back out - in the end, they just annoy most of the public and turn them off the The Zeitgeist Movement all together. Then there is a group (who I have found to be the most active) building within the Movement that are getting pretty tired of sitting around and just talking. Many are ready to actually do something.

Although I do agree that we need to focus on spreading information to people who haven't a clue that society is falling apart - I don't think we need to jump into "building a city" just yet either. That's why I love Evolver, it covers so many different topics for change, and most are locally focused. I think that we are at a tipping point in society, and although I agree with The Zeitgeist Movement in most of what it stands for, The Venus Project is not going to be the ONLY thing that will save humanity. I feel that this is a big problem with The Zeitgeist Movement, many have their blinders on.

Neil runs V-Radio (v-radio.org), he is a spokesperson for The Venus Project. I feel that his radio show is FAR more beneficial than Peter's Radio Address. Neil has had guests on his show from so many different organizations and backgrounds. And that's what we need to create change.
I feel that the Venus Project is an amazing concept to be as a goal marker. The reality is, we won't see that society for many generations down the line. We need to focus on real world applications of a transition to a society similar to what is proposed by The Venus Project.
Thats a major problem I have with Peter's vocabulary throughout his Radio Shows. He notes "transition" as if it were the next "phase" on the agenda. Transition is HERE NOW. We need to be looking everywhere and to connect as many dots as possible.

---Here's one such example: http://earthship.org/. "Garbage Warrior" is an amazing documentary about how these homes came into creation.

---Open Source Ecology (http://openfarmtech.org/index.php/Main_Page) is another group of folks working towards real change. Neil had them on V-Radio, which was an awesome episode.

---Douglas Malette is an engineer that works on the space shuttle program that recently joined The Zeitgeist Movement. Neil also had him on a recent V-Radio show. Douglas is talking to Fresco and Roxanne about using The Venus Project's 503 non-profit to help back his project - automated hydroponic food production systems.

Obviously, we all do not have the option of getting off the grid and into a alternative energy production. And many of us are not engineers. I feel that we all have to try to change SOMETHING. My wife and I are trying a garden this year. We tried once before, and failed. I figured, why not try again. I guess what I'm getting at is that I think The Movement has been quite stagnant, but things are developing. We need to get more localized, and get less dependent on Peter and Fresco.

that was my point, sorry if this was unclear =)

Thought I'd drop my commentary. I listen to the weekly address by Peter and started listening to Neil's V-Radio. I work with my iphone on podcasts all day which is a luxury as far as being able to listen to that much talk. Actually it makes me wish Evolver had a podcast. But back to the subject,
I've been feeling that both Peter and Jacque are a bit too rationale and scientific method based which is in itself not always a bad thing but to reject spirituality to the extent they do I find disheartening and alienating. Personally I think they could benefit to integrate gnosticism and permaculture design into their knowledge base. The way they've answered questions in these areas has really indicated they don't know much about the new information being given in both these areas. I suspect the same for the movement itself. For me, it all integrates quite well. If I had the time I would seek a way to synergize them in some presentation.

Gnosis for those who don't know, essentially is the origin of spiritual consciousness on the planet which has been the root of all the religions but also suppressed and kept hidden until now. The knowledge coming forward in this era is unprecedented. It gives a notion of how "intellectual animals", that's all of us alive, can become harmonized beings who don't destroy their home planet. Not just a notion but a science to approaching this. The Zeitgeist films almost got to these roots but didn't dig deep enough. They showed the similarities in the archetypes but didn't get to the point of how they present a path of inner development that serves humanity. The religious organizations themselves I agree are corrupted and blanched of nutrients but the esoteric heart of them has yet to be understood by the layperson or for that matter theologians or professors in universities unless they know the hidden doctrines. I know for anyone who hasn't unearthed this info this will sound a bit much but as an Evolver I have to say, Gnostics were the original Evolvers of humanity.

As for Permaculture Design, the Zeitgeist Movement has failed to take hold onto the largest solution to the sustainability question the Earth has going at this time. Any member of the Z Movement who doesn't look deeply into Permaculture is surely missing out on some immediate term solutions that are likely happening already somewhere within range of them. Responsible use of technology has ever been a part of Permaculture design practices.

Anyways, my 2 cents...I still am interested in the Z Movement but agree, let's see it get unhinged from the Venus Project and see some immediate action. If I were to consider the groups in town for the upcoming Localized Resiliency Spore the Zeitgeist group would unfortunately not be on the list. I did have them for the Spore on Gift Economy and gave it a push there. Out of the intellectual arena and into action. There are many people wanting a game plan for when the shit hits the fan.

What a great discussion! I totally agree with all of you. We all need to unite and find a point of agreement on which we can begin to actually do something, such as build our own off-the-grid communities.

Susan, I believe that we're very much on the same wavelength. The bottom line is that nothing and nobody is perfect, and we all need to make an effort to listen to each other. I've been involved in leftist movements that frown up spirituality, and I know how alienating it is. However, I also know that Zeitgeist has attracted many different people of many different beliefs, not just hard-core atheists. I think it's great that ESM came along because it fills a certain void. I've always said that we need revolutionary theory to unite with spirituality. I think of myself as somewhat of a "spiritual anarchist," you could say. I've always felt out of place in spiritual groups who don't want to talk about politics, and political groups who don't want to talk about spirituality.

I think part of our weakness is in the fact that we've been unable to unite our socially conscious side with our spiritual side. Many people who are into spirituality have little understanding of how things in the world actually operate, and many people who do understand the ins and outs of global imperialism haven't a clue about spirituality and haven't had any direct experience beyond the physical world. We're like two halves of a brain who can't come together to form a whole brain. It's crippling us. The ruling elite, however, have their agenda and their own dark connection with the spiritual world perfectly in line, which is one reason why they're so much more powerful than us right now, in my view. What I love about Daniel Pinchbeck and Evolver is the fact that they are breathing spiritual life into the revolutionary left.

However, it's not enough to just talk about spirituality and meditate. We're dealing with real physical forces here, and we do have to DO something at some point. I also have a visceral disagreement with statements such as "technical solutions will give nothing without spiritual evolution," although I hear these types of statements all the time. Really? Giving everyone on Earth a decent quality of life wouldn't do any good, wouldn't count for anything? Most people who are sitting around pondering "spiritual evolution" are people who are living quite privileged lives compared to most people in the world. Many people in the world do not even have basic things like food, clothing, shelter, clean running water, etc. Much of the world lives on less than $1 a day. How much do you spend in a day? How much do I spent in a day? I don't think we even realize how privileged we are. This point of privilege, fused with a lack of knowledge, fused with "spirituality," can create a view of the world that can sound very enlightened but that is quite nonthreatening to the status quo and quite impractical in terms of accomplishing anything.

Here's something I wrote on Facebook, and something that a person wrote in response. I'll refer to her as "New Age Girl":

Me: "I have something to say today! You say that you create reality with your mind, right? But yet, when I talk about living in a world without government, without militaries, without a monetary system, and without war, you say it isn't possible! You say, 'We have to have a government/military/monetary system. There's no other way.' So you don't really believe what you say!"

New Age Girl: "I personally could do without these systems, but I accept there is a lot of good in them, even tho that could be hard to see sometimes. everything everything everything has a positive and negative function. There isn't anything wrong with money, its how we use it. there isn't anything wrong with the military, its how we use it. etc.. and how we use what we have, creates Peace, or it creates War.

These things 'we' want to get rid of are merely symptoms of a deeper dis-ease. Until the healing of that dis-ease is made the primary focus, we will just replace this for that, and end up in the same place. ... See More

A perfect example...take all the money, military toys, etc away...Israel and Palestine will war. They will continue to war until each side gives up the story, acknowledges their OWN trespasses, forgive eachother, and begin to trust. take away all the special interest in world, you will still find gender discrimination, racial discrimination, religious discrimination, etc.. In other words, until we heal, our own hurt will continue to create dis-ease in some form or another."

Perhaps she made some good points. But obviously, she doesn't understand the systemic nature of the world, and most people don't. The war between Israel and Palestine is fueled by the imperialistic interests of the U.S. Without those interests, without a military, and without military toys, there wouldn't be massive numbers of people systemically killed on a daily basis, both there and around the world. But people just don't get it, because all their lives the truth has been hidden from them. Our own hearts have been blamed for all the problems of the world. We blame our own minds. We bought into the story of "original sin" and how we are fundamentally bad.

New Age Girl talks about peace, love and healing. Yet she says, "there isn't anything wrong with the military, its how we use it." If we are peaceful people, healed of our hurts and full of love, then what use do we have with a military? What good is all this talk of spiritual transformation if we can't even ponder the idea of changing things on a physical level? Are some people afraid to let go of the military? Are they afraid that there are people in the world who might come for revenge, who might come to take what's theirs? Are they really ready to make those changes within themselves, and those changes in their way of life, that need to be made for the good of all mankind? Are we?

This can't just be a mental exercise or a spiritual exercise. We have to stop supporting the system. Period. That means radically changing how we live, and letting go of a lot of our luxuries, at least for now. Advanced, sustainable technology like the kind presented in TVP won't be able to flourish until the system has been brought--or has fallen--to its knees.

Sobey brought up a complaint about TZM that I have heard a few times now. He said that they're not really into the idea of permaculture, local farming, etc. That makes absolutely no sense to me. Fresco talked about the fact that agriculture could be performed by machines, which I believe is true. A lot of it is already done by machines, even precise things like picking the tassels off the tops of corn stalks. However, he clearly states that in his vision, farming is completely organic and done at a local level. Each little community has its own little farm where every person has access to fresh organic food.

To me, the first logical step toward this type of world is to begin doing the farming ourselves. Also, producing our own food is the first logical step toward reducing our dependence on federal reserves notes (money). Our dependence on federal reserve notes is what keeps us trapped in the system, keeps us perpetuating it. I'm not saying that we just form a commune. I'm saying that we form an international system of people who live off the grid (or as much as possible), and who bring more and more people into this system, which will be decentralized and self-organizing.

If it's true that the Z people don't want to get into local farming or permaculture, then that's too bad because that's the one thing I think we should all be doing together! But somehow, I think that's not true for everybody in TZM.

The Zeitgeist Movement is not what most people, even many people in the Movement, thinks it is. It is not a 'force' for change, or a 'force' of any kind. It is not an organization for political change, or a protest group, or a religious group, and it is definitely not an economic enterprise. To understand it, people have to step outside their usual ways of thinking, and resist the urge to pigeonhole it in some previous 'category' of any kind. Nothing like it has ever existed before, and the concepts are totally new, something not previously thought of by anyone.

Peace and Good Health,
Roan Carratu worldmind@yahoo.com

Actually, your point is part of the 'we' I am talking about. It's a gestalt of individual choices and interests that all together should create a world worth living in for our descendants. I was mostly addressing the expedient goals of the monetary system, which are currently destroying the ecosystem. It is what is doing the most damage, imho.

Peace and Good Health,
Roan Carratu