Hey Movement! Stop Arguing!
posted by Boadie | April 15, 2010
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IcerocketSo, we want to have a movement. But the problem is that we can't stop arguing with each other.
Don't get me wrong. Argument, to some extent, is a healthy and natural part of the process. It can hardly be avoided. Collectively, we are like one giant brain with different neurons working together and frictioning against each other, just trying to figure it out. Some arguments need to be hashed out.
However, I think there is a lot of pointless arguing going on and that it's impeding our progress. The useless arguing that I'm referring to goes something like this:
A person comes along and says, "What we need is peace."
Then somebody else comes along and says, "No, it's not about peace. It's about love. Once you have love, peace flows naturally. By trying to create peace, you're putting your focus on the wrong thing."
Then a third person comes along and says, "We must first develop compassion before we can have either peace or love, so you're both wrong."
And then there's a great big huge debate over NOTHING! I mean, what are even talking about anyway?
It is this kind of arguing and mental masturbation that is preventing us from being a real movement.
I think part of the problem is that everybody, including myself sometimes, has a big fat fucking EGO that we need to learn how to GET OVER.
What we really need to do is open up to each other and listen with our hearts and our tummies, instead of our brains and our ears which are really not very good at listening. Brains are much better at projecting than they are at listening. You have to listen with the heart. You have to listen with what you have on the inside, which hears beyond words. Words do not matter, and the definitions of words do not matter. These are all just mental constructs. The only thing that matters is the intention behind the words.
But that's just my opinion that I'm sure someone will disagree with.
Comments
I don't think those kinds of
— Apr 15, 2010
I don't think those kinds of discussions are harmful in anyway. I mean, their unproductive to begin with so who cares how they unfold.
I'm in support of all arguments that are carried out with civility and an intent to find a solution.
Don't be erasing your posts!
— Apr 16, 2010
Don't be erasing your posts! lol
Non-Fractal Compression creates heat=Hell
thank you;) "A religious man
— Apr 15, 2010
thank you;) "A religious man goes into a dessert...he meets two other religious men on his travels . they sit down to enjoy the evening, light a fire, pass around a pipe, and/or drink some tea. Dusk fades to night and the beauty of the full moon fills the sky. The first religious man sees this and smiles, he lifts his finger and points to the moon. "Look at the beautiful Moon!" He exclaims. The second religious man looks at the firsts hand, follows his finger and sees Luna. "No no!" he cries, "that is luna!" The third shakes his head, sets down his tea. "Not luna, not the moon, but rather the great goddess." He states proudly. All begin to argue, the anrgy fire breaths." not this, but that, no this not that, no no its this way." The Arguing turns sour, the moon begins to fade, the night picks up her jewled treasures and quietly tip toes away. The men, having not rest, return to their villages to tell of the assholes they met in the dessert."
I think its ok to be
— Apr 16, 2010
I think its ok to be challenged by what we say, the point is to find higher level understandings. So it went from: peace-love-compassion. Love is the golden mean ratio! Compassion is compression non destructively! It seems to me people can't think for themselves now a days. So the point of an argument is to find misunderstandings and convert them into understanding. I mean come on people. Do you know how advanced this statement is? "compassion=compression" If we all understood just that we would create a new world instantly. Have you not asked yourself what compassion really is? What love(LoPhi) really is? If you really asked you would get your answer. Now i could get all religious and say if you don't learn the information contained on goldenmean.info you will burn in hell. Compression creates heat if it isn't fractal! So put two and two together people. Every last major discovery in the last how many hundreds of years is based on the fractal! Every last problem can be explained as non-fractal, which is a loss of coherence. Religion=fractal hygiene! Religion is dead! There should be objective science(normal science) and subjective science(religion),So if there is a "revolution" it will be a revolution in education of fractals. The new motto should be "get fractal or get dead". And we all should have ego(tonal island) around survival issues, thats what the ego is far, a guardian.
Non-Fractal Compression creates heat=Hell
a bit of a waffle i made that i think is relavent
— Apr 16, 2010
http://www.evolver.net/user/moontrap/blog/dualistic_oppositions_generate...
A weed in the narcissist's garden
Useless vs. Productive Arguing
— Apr 16, 2010
I think you have to take the "good arguments" with the "bad arguments."
It's like making creative works: 90% of what you make is going to be bad, but you have to make the really bad in order to be able to make the 10% that is good as well.
Gender Differences
— Apr 16, 2010
I think a lot of the difference is in communications mode -- "Am I expecting agreement and empathy, or disagreement and progress?"
Great blog Moontrap! Very
— Apr 16, 2010
Great blog Moontrap! Very well done! :)
The problem is not with debate per se, which can be healthy as I stated. The problem is our tendency to get stuck in oppositional thought patterns and duality, as you did such a great job of explaining.
Thank you!
I like your post... it's
— Apr 16, 2010
I like your post... it's like arguing about what came first the chicken or the egg I mean huh?... I find specially ridiculous discussing/arguing about how the oneness interacts and what reality is... I mean is good to have theories but honestly nobody knows!!! it's like when the astronomers and physicists talk about dark matter/dark energy they are very clear when they say they call it that because they do not know what it is... another discussion that I found pointless was the one about Avatar!!! man I swear they where blogs about that for weeks and what came out of that?...nothing...
On the other there are posts where ppl share personal experiences, things they've done and have worked for them, post documentaries or movies, poetry, speak about divination... now that's something I personally find appealing and yes I don't comment much so I like to save those in my favs and read them as needed.
I'm no one to say what is to be posted or not but as a personal statement I won't participate/comment on posts about the real reality or the what we truly are (as if any of us knew )
OBSCURITIES and doubt
— Apr 16, 2010
This site brings people from many walks of life, into one place, of course there are different perspectives. Why do you find issue with that? Is the only path to world peace forcing each other to agree on philosophy? There could be world peace because we're self actualized enough to achieve it ...rather than being forcing eachother into one size fits all mold. talk about recipe for disaster. The arguments seem to happen when some people believe steps need to be taken before we take leaps. You don't jump off something without looking at how far down your landing is, come on, talk about squirly notions. These are the same flawed spirits that create religions. So please join, expand your consciousness to accept truth, not just popularly backed opinions.
E prime is all about not
— Apr 17, 2010
E prime is all about not using the word 'is". Could say that "has" is just a different tense of "is", no? Either way, doesn't change the truth behind the statement Huxley made a point of proclaiming, though it seems.
"Life's a garden, dig it"
I am part of the problem/solution
— Apr 17, 2010
Passion and strong opinions inspire affinity and discord within us. Unavoidable. Sometimes it is not just a disagreement, or a tangent off of the original idea, but rather a blog within a blog within a blog ad infinitum...its organic in structure, some bloom some fizzle out, very natural. I like you post, you are a strong woman who wants action instead of "waste" of time spent bickering here. Ironically i see you as a lady who likes to fight, so maybe you are self inspired by what you deem to be mistakes? And then you are asking all of us to stop arguing by arguing why you think we should stop arguing. I love it. But look, sometimes it is those "stupid" ideas and "silly" arguments that lead great thinkers to insight and breakthroughs . A little randomness is healthy, and some more coherency, as you propose, would also be fantastic. Thanks for speaking out :)
' Let the beauty we love be what we do...there are a hundred ways to kneel and kiss the ground." Rumi
There's a lot of Evolvers,
— Apr 17, 2010
There's a lot of Evolvers, at many different stages of development. Some have been exploring consciousness and working on themselves consciously for a long time; others, months (I still consider myself rather closer to the latter). Given this, misunderstandings are inevitable and so are arguments.
Also there's a lot of things about which the truth remains nebulous. How can those not be argued about?
Neither you nor anyone here can keep abreast of every conversation that gets started on this site. One's own interaction must inevitably be but a thin slice of everything that goes on, and so it's up to you to interact with the right slice.
What actually makes Evolver really stand out to me, when compared to much of the rest of the Net, is how courteous and open the people generally are to one another. Even when disagreeing, it's in a collegial, companionable fashion: a mutual interest in determining truth, not a competition to see who's right. How many interactions have you seen devolve into mud-slinging flame wars? I can't recall a single example.
But generally I find disagreement to be at a particular minimum here, just due I suppose to the intellectual humility natural to a group composed of those rare types who've had their personal realities blown wide open. The comments I see are characterized more by compassionate emotional support (which we could all use some of, surrounded as we tend to be in the real world by people in whose estimation we are probably clinically insane) than they are by ego. It's all about reading between the words.
So reading between yours, yes, actually, I agree. I sense your frustration that things haven't really started happening yet: the vision you hold in your heart remains largely unmanifested in the world. Like a race-horse before the meet you're eager to go. I feel that too and all I can say is: patience. We are embarked on a program of change so sweeping and profound that few of us can yet fully grasp what we are about.
The gun's about to go off, the race will soon start and then there will be no time for arguing, only doing and so, the arguing will cease, at least amongst those who know they're in a race.
The rEvoLution is Within
Thanks Boadie...
— Apr 17, 2010
I think you are making some valid points even though I couldn't say exactly when 'ego' has overrun any particular blog. That may be because I don't take any of these posts personally, nor does it 'feel' to me as if many participants do. What may be fairly consistent is the lack of appreciation for the obvious (to me) sincerity people express with here.
I really do appreciate the sincerity Daniel, Jonathon, Ken and the others who manage the sites have. And I appreciate the various perspectives people bring to whatever discussion they join or start.
It is this level of engagement, this 'coming from the heart' that is what maintains an infinite number of possibilities for us all. Recognizing this, in one another, as we engage one another, is what will energetically bring people together with their appropriate 'soul mates' or 'spiritual family' or whatever you want to call those people you deeply resonate with - those with whom they are pretty much drawn to work with physically, here and now in these times.
As far as evolver or any other organized thing that any of us may do... how it all works out is what I feel we are here to learn, our 'raison d'être' if you will...
In happy anticipation of the results of our experience here, I wish you all peace,
Steve
eggonalimb.net
Avoiding arguments -> avoiding linguistic traps...
— Apr 18, 2010
Having unnecessary arguments can be avoided through formulating ourselves differently - I must say, I learn this every day - here some words from a true master on this:
Robert Anton Wilson - Language, Reason & Reality
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCIqFAdI6eI&aia
I accept that the answer to the question “who am I?” is eternal
http://florries.wordpress.com/
