I'm confused about the emotion of feeling "guilty." May I have your thoughts please?

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groks

Guilt.

It's got a negative connotation right off the bat. If you feel guilty it's probably because you did something "wrong." But let's break it down a little bit.

There's two sides of the spectrum I see.

On one side there is a person who lives their life guilt free. This doesn't mean they are a "bad" person, it just means that they don't allow themselves to carry the weight of negative emotions. There is more to this, but my personality doesn't sit on this side of the spectrum as much, so I can't really speak for it.

The other side of the spectrum is someone who is more aware of the emotions of others. They strive to keep everyone happy, perhaps even in some cases at the expense of themselves. They would feel guilty if they did something that would inconvenience someone else, because they know they have the capability of increasing the welfare of others at what they feel is little to no expense to them, in most circumstances.

So I pose the question. Is guilt an unnecessary emotion? Or do we need it to be able to be considerate of others? Or is it possible that there is someplace outside the spectrum where we can sit that actually doesn't include feeling guilt but includes being considerate? Or would that conflict? If it doesn't, how doesn't it? And maybe most importantly, how can we work to achieve that equilibrium if it really is possible?

As evolvers we hope to have answers for others. Does anyone have an answer for me?

I'll give several real life examples... that got me thinking

1) My parents got divorced last summer, separated a few years back. We used to always do a family picture christmas card, now my mom does valentines day cards with just a picture of her and my sister and me. My dad hates it cause he has friends in common with my mom so it's a slap in the face to him because it says (on a holiday where no one else is receiving family pictures) that this is the family now, without him. Maybe there's more to it in his mind.

Regardless I don't like getting the picture taken, because I empathize with my dad, but mostly I find it outright embarrassing. This is now the second year taking the picture/sending the card, but I would feel guilty not going along with the charade. Should I just say to my mom and sister, "No thanks" next year?

2) My Dad came down for my birthday the other night with his girlfriend. I didn't want to go. Should I have just said, "No thanks."?

3) My roommate was late for class this morning. We have class at the same time. He likes to shower in the mornings, I guess I'm a scrub, I just throw on the sweat pants and head out the door after I take a wiz and brush my teeth. But if he wakes up a little too late he'll take the shower, and I can't do either of those things, which makes me late for class. That's alright of course, it just happens, but after he gets out of the shower instead of feeling "guilty" about making me late and throwing on the towel to get dressed, he instead puts in his contacts, and brushes his teeth, remaining in the bathroom, as opposed to doing those things after I quickly use the bathroom while he gets dressed, which is no skin off his back. I'll talk to him about it today. But I feel like he is very enlightened, and interestingly he stresses not having the emotion of guilt. But he lacked a consideration or empathy of me this morning.

So there ya have it! Anyone got an answer? Dr. Phil? Ha (just kidding)

Comments

Just stop doing things that are wrong.

It's that simple. Guilty is largely optional, you need not have it. When in doubt ask your conscience an do what it says. If things seem gray then more then likely they are wrong. The conscience requires very little second guessing it is usually 99% right. If a decision is still unclear then ask someone before taking an action. Sounds blunt, to the point and simple; it is. Fill each day with the next right action and the next and the next and the ........... If you do error make it as right as you can as soon as you can then move on to the next right action. In some instances you may have to really change to keep from doing wrongs over and over again.

Guilt piles up, it accumulates so in time you may get to the point where you can no longer live with yourself and that's a bad place to be. One becomes soul sick.

did you

read through the entire blog and the examples? it isn't about right or wrong.. its about consideration versus inconsideration.

.......

consideration versus inconsideration comes before the guilt.

ohhh well hmmm

this must where my confusion lies! please explain.. im realizing as I write papers for class that what is obvious to me isn't to the teacher and I get marked off points, so how does that statement correlate with the example with my roommate if you don't mind me asking? and sorry for my presupposition but sometimes i don't read blogs all the way through when they are somewhat longer

Your Fathers guilt is not

your own, it belongs to him. Your guilt might lay with the fact that you are angry with him for doing this to you. If you are not guilty about these feelings then you might ask yourself why. If you are angry and feel guilty about it then you should apologize to him for it and then get up before he does in the morning. If you are not part of the solutions to your own problems then there may not be solutions. We do what we can about our problems then accept what we can not change about them, No small task, accepting. for in accepting one must learn about the ego.

Be wiser then your Father when you are his age and the world will be a better place.

I'm not going to help any further with your paper. I'm done.

My mistake it was your roommate not your Father. My apologize for the error. That's better, now I'm guilt free. :)

ha

yea i really like the idea of always finding a solution within yourself to your own problems... i think that is empowering

I think that just this word

I think that just this word "guilt" alone raises some other questions which may need addressing before we can even consider the implications of this words meaning.

For the human guilt is not required. For the being cannot escape it. The extent to which there is guilt is due to a lack or a scarcity somewhere in our lives. Do any of the "lower" animals feel guilt when they eat another animal? I doubt it. Every living creature on earth has a hierarchy of values. The lion which is better suited to live in the wild is not concerned with paying a mortgage, but she may be concerned with feeding her cubs. We might say she is self-obsessed with her needs which is directly associated with her hierarchy of values and we can see that anything beyond those needs have no place in the value system.

If a man should become so self-obsessed that he no longer thinks but merely responds to external stimuli, at best he may only think that is thinking. Having forgotten his hierarchy of values and the bootstraps which come with being. So this human animal which either cannot feeling or does not feel is no different from a rock which is also self-obsessed and cannot feel for anything but to be a rock. Certainly you can feel for others and not feel guilty as a natural part of your being. If you are living your life as you know you should, learning, growing, reevaluating your experience, taking responsibility for your intuition, what do you have to be guilty for? You certainly shouldn't feel guilty for any psychic propensity you might have and particularly the lack of guilt another may have in your presence. There is absolutely no reason you cannot be better than that.

For one to dare to call themselves a human being they must be capable of facing all their emotions not just picking threw the ones that make life easier. Such a creature cannot complain when the shoe is on the other foot. There are men in our midst to which your life doesn't calculate into their hierarchy of values anywhere and depending on who we're talking about and their environment can totally understand why. Not approving their disregard for life, but I certainly understand and never underestimate the power of this human animal to be anything it chooses to be. So your roommate may be fairly enlightened, but if he only lives in a one season world which he's created for himself, then enlightenment is only within that season and that framework of his values. Which, this individual wholeheartedly admits and advocates shutting off an emotion of the being. Thereby closing off ability to be anything other than that human animal. I'm not sure what caused this but it sounds like some damage was done to induce the behavior. If this is how they were raised, if this is how they were treated early on in life then it could be that they feel perfectly justified in their behavior because that's what's they know; it's what most comfortable or reassuring. This doesn't necessarily make them untrustworthy, though it does make them somewhat predictable. Remember that we are all here to teach each other the things we need to know. The behavior of another is like a sign post indicating to you just where you are on your path. This experience is necessary for you to learn to adapt. Perhaps provide for the responsibility to get up earlier.

How we go about accepting what is appropriate or not can have a profound impact on our experiences. I think it important to note that "all human interaction is contractual in nature". That is communication is done so by way of agreements. We cannot determine how to treat any given thing if we cannot agree and it begins with words themselves. You created this blog, it is your offering. I have accepted it as value and am now returning it for value. Now on internet blogs it may be slightly different, but in your personal relationships. If someone makes an offer and you say nothing or do not object, then you agreed. This is called silent acquiescence and it has profound implications in law and can have equally formidable implications in our personal lives. In law, silent acquiescence is used in tacit procuration. In our personal relationships without the state and it's gun in the room silence grants consent and often leads to conflict. Which can certainly end with the state having to settle the dispute. A lot of marriages end just this way. Corporate break-up.

Some might say, honor thy father and mother, I can't really say if it was best for you to go out with your father or not. Family tends to think of themselves above the law of contract since most family relations are superfluous. Etymology turns up an interesting perspective on this thing we call family.

familiar (adj.)
mid-14c., “intimate, very friendly, on a family footing,” from O.Fr. famelier, from L. familiaris “domestic, of a household;” also “familiar, intimate, friendly,” dissimilated from *familialis, from familia (see family). The sense gradually broadened. Of things, from late 15c. The noun meaning “demon, evil spirit that answers one’s call” is from 1580s.

“demon, evil spirit that answers one’s call” this is your family we're talking here...? lol

So drawing back upon this concept that we are all here on this planet to teach one another that which we came into this existence to learn. I honestly can't say if you should honor thy parents or take a lesson and teach them a lesson. And we could always look at where this word parents came from...

Parens Patriae: The state is the supreme guardian of all children within its jurisdiction, and state courts have the inherent power to intervene to protect the best interests of children whose welfare is jeopardized by controversies between parents.

So when people say they are the parent, they have no idea what they're really saying. Then they wonder why the State does what it does and wanna call out corruption. There is a corruption going on here no doubt, it's one of understanding to which most people silently acquiesce to. What makes one day any more holy than another? I can't tell you where this concept of patriarchy came from either, but it has become obvious for me that it's much more economical, if you are responsible for the population of a society where you want to greatly limit your liability, to cultivate patriarchy. We can then look out at society and see the social acceptance of this concept, and in fact it is a highly regarded value among the majority of the populace. Which has, from long before we even came into this world, been conditioned into this society. It's all we know, it's what we identify with in the current social structure. Who can really say if these adulterous relationships; these marriages between Man, Woman, and State were ever meant to last?

With any offer there are basically four options:

-Reject the Offer, which depending on who's offer you're rejecting can have the effect of conflict.
-Silence, which grants consent which can lead to conflict.
-Unconditional Acceptance, whereby you take wherever you get.
-Conditional Acceptance, whereby you accept conditionally. A condition could be acceptance upon a proof of claim that terms be met.

The most honorable thing we can do is accept all offers, but we obviously can't accept every ones crap. But we must also take care how we go about not accepting such crap. Sometimes you can straight-up reject someones crap without retribution. Other spirited beings may be more likely to forgive you than say the State, a corporation, or perhaps even you are. You can't stay silent then come later and say, "but I didn't agree". Well you can, but you have to take into consideration where this is going. Conditionally acceptance has turned up some startling results versus State officials, but not so good versus irrational family members that typically do not like ultimatums. Not that this is what that is, but to family it can certainly be interpreted that way. It is however a type of shifting the "burden" back onto the offertory. Still, In order to have peace there has to be an agreement as to what peace is.

Everyone, whether they recognize it or not does these things and goes threw one of these four doors, that's predictable. How each of us employs them, which doors we take depending on the circumstances, that's not so predictable. I do however find this knowledge to be a very powerful language and communication tool, especially when contracting with other strangers and those I generally don't trust. I tend to be a little more laid back and less assertive so knowing exactly what's going on at any given moment greatly helps balance that out. Anytime there is a meeting of the minds, no matter how vague, it will not benefit you to be unclear. So be clear, be absolutely clear about your intentions, save that guilt, and you'll start to scare the shit out of everyone you talk to. Because it is powerful, it's where authorship or authority derives, when you create an agreement. All there is, is contract; contract is the law; the law is the contract.

Anyway, hope you get something out of this.

"Seek not abroad, turn back into thyself, for in the inner man dwells the truth..."

thank you

that was very informative, I loved the references back to law because it is an area I am unfamiliar with, and it makes sense why there are so many correlations between formal contracts of states and corporations, and the daily agreements among friends and family.

 http://changaevolution.blog

 http://changaevolution.blogspot.com

postponed responsability...

Not sure where this is

Not sure where this is directing, there's no article, didn't see anything that looked like "postponed responsibility".

(kinda sounds like discharging a debt into the future)

"Seek not abroad, turn back into thyself, for in the inner man dwells the truth..."

guilt

I read a month ago that guilt is the guardian of our values. So when we are feeling guilty, it just means that we have acted contrary to them. Now the thing is, sometimes our values are not our own, they are immposed from external sources. So we have to see what value did we wrong to make us feeling guilty. Like in your example about the photo, why do you feel guilty? For not pleasing your mom? how about pleasing you? Is it so important for you, or your mom that photo? If it is so important for you not to take it, don't, and don't feel guilty about expressing yourself. If you think is more important for your mom to take it, then do, and feel well about helping your mom.
About your roommate, he either doesn't have values, or his principal and main value is to be pleased no matter what or who. Well, that's his problem, just wait and watch where it gets him. Or maybe and most likely, he just doesn't want to be hurt, like he has been in the past and has the strategy to strike first (I don't care about the rest, so it doesn't matter if you don't care about me).
So, guilt is useful to keep you on the right track, but don't forget to re-evaluate your values every so, to help being imposed with external morale.
Hope it helped ;)

yea

i liked how its a balancing act towards self and others, where the importance lies

Guilt?

I just wanted to add that physically it's been observed that all emotion is simply physiological arousal (heart beat, sweat, etc) and that our "subjective variance" - our internal description of a situation's context, what's going on around you - frames and shapes our "emotions."

That aside, I would really think about guilt in each and every situation - it certainly doesn't happen universally, i.e we don't experience guilt equally.

Peace.

i think i just realized

when you think highly you can understand that fear creates guilt and living your original understanding and desire would actually be accepted and sometimes applauded but if you have fear of every situatation then you can never be cool about it

Guilt is just Poison

Shame is when something you feel guilty about is known by one or more people besides yourself. Both guilt and shame are used against people by some large mainstream religions to keep people in line and in fear.
Guilt is NOT useful or necessary for higher consciousness. Here is why - the number 11.
11 is the archetype of innocence. It is also the arena of illusions. As sentient beings some of us humans are under the illusion that we are separate. This is known as ego. The ego believes it is a 1 and that others are 1. This ego creates the illusionary belief of 1 looking at supposed other 1's which are not the same 1 as itself, hence creating fear of the number 11.
11 is also the number for theater, actors and the trickster. 'I will pretend I am this 1 and you on the other side of the mirror are a (lessor/greater) 1 than I' says the ego.
In the universal view, we all are children playing pretend games in paradise. The choices we make, whether based on fear or loyalty, are all innocent choices no matter what species or star system we are home to. Those who practice fear, which is where guilt and shame reside, those beings are learning through choosing that path. It is not wise to force anyone's choice. How would we learn? Drink poison if you choose.
Red Color

thanks

thats what i was realizing last night, that fear creates guilt,

it seems we should just be living as what we know is true to ourselves, and as much as possible respect others, if they do not appreciate ourselves being true, then is that their problem to worry about? are we creating that problem or are they?

Guilt is simple

It is cause for reflection. A time to take the perspective of the other into consideration.

Evolutionarily speaking, it was (and still is) generally meant to ensure group cohesion, by keeping people in alignment with the group moral consensus -- what is considered "right", and what is considered "wrong". That very healthy natural instinct has, unfortunately, been hijacked by people who want to manipulate you into actions which may actually be considered "wrong", upon further investigation -- depending on your personal agreement about what is right and wrong for that situation.

So, we must be wary of guilt, but not in a knee-jerk sort of fashion. I believe the actual source of guilt is a sort of empathic link, wherein one person feels suddenly "offended" -- as you have gone against their personal moral ideal -- and your own psychic receptors register that as a feeling of "guilt".

Of course, if your previous history has caused you to expect certain actions to offend, then upon performing those actions you may preemptively assume offense and hence feel guilt -- even if the other person has not actually been offended. Pavlov's bell ringing.

Each decision must be made in a conscious and case-by-case fashion, with careful consideration of the evidence and the surrounding circumstances, as well as genuine and meaningful attempts to understand the 'other side' of whatever situation might be causing the feeling of guilt.

This might include, but is not limited to, asking the person in question about their feelings and listening to their side of the story.

And, while I am not Christian, I still know of no better general advice than the Golden Rule: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

"You must *be* the change you wish to see in the world."
Mahatma Gandhi

guilt is an indicator

pay closer attention to your thoughts and actions...........Meditate...........alot........If you meditate then most of the questions you have will be answered spontaneously from deep within your true nature..... you already know the answer to things like this....just quiet and listen and you will know.............watch guilt.......watch anger.....watch joy......watch yourself become unfocused.......ah how beautiful, how mysterious

Innocence = In non sence Let

Innocence = In non sence

Let me suggest a read since I don't have time to discuss right now...

Dr. John F Demartini Book: Inspired Destiny; Chapter 10: Embracing the Duality of Life; Subchapter: The Connection Between Your Emotions and Your Fulfillment; Page 166.

http://books.google.com/books?id=SnES6sq1T5YC&pg=PA116&lpg=PA116&dq=insp...

"Seek not abroad, turn back into thyself, for in the inner man dwells the truth..."

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